Or Hextall's final season. Or Holmgren's final season.

But hey... it's a New Era of Orange!!!
- BaronVonShiznit

they are still probably patting themselves on the back for being in the hunt...

have the flyers "ruined" Fedotov?

The Flyers already failed the litmus test whether they are really rebuilding or not. You don’t have to wait until TK is resigned to figure it out.
- StepfordSam

To be fair… they still have time. Although that time is running out. And also if they do move players what’s the debate on return? From doing it sooner rather than later? All will come to a head soon enough

To be fair… they still have time. Although that time is running out. And also if they do move players what’s the debate on return? From doing it sooner rather than later? All will come to a head soon enough
- Stayin alive

That’s what we’ve been saying for the last decade lol.

Flyers end up in the same spot they do every season. At least I didn’t bother to watch more than like 10 games this season. Wake me up when Comcast finally sells to someone with a clue.

Did they really identify him, though? If I remember correctly, they wanted Sanguinetti who was chosen one pick before Giroux, leaving the Flyers to pick the next player on their list.
- Stanley Cup

That is correct. They were going classic Flyers big and slow. Holmgren had to make the pick because in Clarke's eyes Sang was the only acceptable pick. God bless Glenn Sather

Because it's an unnecessary evil. There's no need to add vets. They have that. Age doesn't mean vet. Years in the league does. No reason to add Staal. Even Hathaway wasn't called for despite him being relatively decent.
- Pelle31Forever

hathaway is a great signing if you don't sign nic d

Nobody likes seeing their team get embarrassed during an important game. It looks like after all is said and done that the team will basically end up where many expected. A playoff bubble team.
If Hart didn’t have his legal issues maybe the flyers goaltending doesn’t implode and they squeak in.
What’s next is anybody’s guess.
Are the flyers really going to rebuild or an aggressive retool? No one here knows.
We can all speculate and think DB is a Torts bootlicker and taking his marching orders from upper management.
The fact is until DB has to really make team altering decisions we can’t be sure.
I’m in the wait and see mode. I am hopeful he gets it. If he pulls the status quo offseason good team GM thing and tinkers with role players and resigns TK they will not be better next year or even years down the road.
In fact by the time Torts is gone the flyers will still be the same team they are now.
For me the test will be if DB has the brass ones to trade TK and Laughton. Pick up a solid backup goalie. Use any cap space to pick up assets.
Fire Lappy in Lehigh. Hire a coach for the phantoms that is legit and can be groomed to coach the flyers some day if he is successful.
Infuse the big team with young players. If you need some veteran presence fine but if they can’t play then don’t bother.
Unload guys like Nic D.
Target high risk high reward players in the later rounds instead of the 200’ player mentality that is more of a sure thing to make the NHL.
Those guys can be found pretty easily across the league.
I would tell Torts he isn’t going to the front office so be a coach and leave the rest up to the front office.
If you don’t like that don’t let the door hit you in the arse.
I’m not expecting this to happen but this where I would go.

I’m just trying to take some of the positives away…to me there were a few. This team was never a cup threat, that’s why I can’t get to worked up by the last few weeks. I see two former 1rst rnd picks that actually look like players.
- landros 2

I understand. There's potential to right the ship but given their track record I'm a glass half empty kinda guy on it.

hathaway is a great signing if you don't sign nic d
- anti-lame

They overpaid for him. All in all it's moot because has a purpose out there.

Main point I was making is those moves are unnecessary if you're truly rebuilding.

have the flyers "ruined" Fedotov?
- hello it's me 2050

Because they threw him to the wolves at the tender age of 27?

would you:

- trade a 3rd rd pick to move ND? knowing they will not waive him.

- clean house and buy out: Cal, Cam, RyJo. Has to be all 3 for the sake of this discussion.

-trade the florida 2024 1st or the 2025 avs 1st for a young potential 2nd pair dman or 2nd line center?

would you:

- trade a 3rd rd pick to move ND? knowing they will not waive him.

- clean house and buy out: Cal, Cam, RyJo. Has to be all 3 for the sake of this discussion.

-trade the florida 2024 1st or the 2025 avs 1st for a young potential 2nd pair dman or 2nd line center?
- hello it's me 2050

If I'm trading the 2 1sts it's for something better. Flyers already have 2nd pair dmen (skill wise) in Sanheim and York. Frost could still be a 2c.

would you:

- trade a 3rd rd pick to move ND? knowing they will not waive him.

- clean house and buy out: Cal, Cam, RyJo. Has to be all 3 for the sake of this discussion.

-trade the florida 2024 1st or the 2025 avs 1st for a young potential 2nd pair dman or 2nd line center?
- hello it's me 2050

-yes

-no, I would rather just ride the deals out next season and have them completely off the books when Michkov (hopefully) comes over.

-I guess that depends on who. If they were a player with "possible" 1st pair or "possible" 1C potential while being sure fire 2nd pair/2c options I may consider. (I have no idea who that would be.) The 2024 pick would be my preference to trade if given the choice.

Yeah I guess you can say some made some natural progression. But it was hampered and a full picture or data was stunted. My frustration is simply that it’s as clear as day what needs to be done. Look at what guerin did in minny. Not saying Philly is same but when new regime comes in it’s one thing to say things but it’s what you do.

It’s kinda like Obama running on change but actually doing nothing. And winning marketing awards on campaign.

For me the key is tk. Move for assets maybe they get it. Sign him to extension status quo

Unfortunately like I’ve said many times Philly has a huge fan base full of blind idiots that they know they can exploit from. The most interesting thing they do is what new spin they use to draw these idiots in.

Not saying anyone on here is one of those idiots but we know some are. Defending and buying the excuses put out there. The sad thing is definitely doesn’t need to be this way
- Stayin alive

As I’ve shown in the past,( not that anyone follows my views or cares… lol) my opinions on the guys in charge can change. I try to give the benefit of the doubt but don’t like being fed BS comments when the actual actions say something different. I think DB has done some decent things but also been part of some things that are not good for the teams future.
I’m really on the fence and am interested to see if there is a plan or is it Fletcher 2.O.

Disagree.

Torts called out Coots and the fanbase branded Coots a whiner. Torts buried Hayes and the fanbase ate it up and DB god rid of him as soon as humanly possible. Torts banished TDA and he was gone almost immediately. Torts expressed frustration with Allison and he never got called up again. Torts wanted Johansen nowhere near the team and RJ has been persona non grata.

Management and the fanbase (outside of HB) are still 100% behind Torts.

So if Torts brands a player a quitter... well you can take it to the bank that the fans will rip that player to shreds and that DB will immediately look to move that player. Torts would LOVE a clear excuse to get rid of certain guys.

I don't think guys like Farabee and Frost are giving him that excuse tho. As Torts said, they're still giving max effort even if they haven't been playing perfectly.

IMO.
- Tomahawk

Without even questioning whether you are going too far ... ("100% behind Torts"...), there are two issues that distinguish this situation from the previous one.

1. One can pull off the drill sergeant shtick when the team is winning. Public opinion is fickle, and will start to sway if there are collapses. I don't mean to suggest it will be "100% against Torts" but people in the middle will swing away.

2. In all of those situations, it was a single player. Saying the entire team is a bunch of quitters/soft/lack balls is different esp if the team is losing. Ok,so if the team is full of quitters, does that mean you get rid of young talent like York, Foerster, Farabee, ? What do you with the 8 year terms of Sanheim/SC? And what does it say about the management who put the team together? And why should fans come to watch quitters? Commercially, this cannot be sustained.

would you:

- trade a 3rd rd pick to move ND? knowing they will not waive him.

- clean house and buy out: Cal, Cam, RyJo. Has to be all 3 for the sake of this discussion.

-trade the florida 2024 1st or the 2025 avs 1st for a young potential 2nd pair dman or 2nd line center?
- hello it's me 2050

I would keep ND.

Stash all three in the minors or press box .

I need names for the potential trades….ie I like BO Byram….if that’s the type of guy you get then draft picks can be moved…but I see no need to move draft capital unless it’s for a potential game changer.

have the flyers "ruined" Fedotov?
- hello it's me 2050

I think it’s still good to get him into some games and get his feet wet. They really aren’t making it easy on him by their play, but it’s still good to get him some experience.

I would keep ND.

Stash all three in the minors or press box .

I need names for the potential trades….ie I like BO Byram….if that’s the type of guy you get then draft picks can be moved…but I see no need to move draft capital unless it’s for a potential game changer.
- landros 2

You won’t get a potential game changer with a late 1st. You may get an already somewhat proven youngish player with some upside. That is likely further along than at late 1st who could be years away.

Based on they have spent their whole lives in hockey. Especially briere with modern nhl. They know HOW to fix it. Whether they CAN is another question but they definitely know HOW
- Stayin alive

but they WONT

It’s kinda like Obama running on change but actually doing nothing. And winning marketing awards on campaign.

- Stayin alive

You mean the guy who inherited an economic crisis that was the greatest since the great depression and put together a bipartisan team of economists who brought about a recovery far quicker than any other country on earth was able to do? The guy who passed the most sweeping domestic legislation in the US in the past 50 years, fighting both extreme political opposition and public opinion to a present situation where it is now very solidly popular for many years?

I don't understand this penchant for off the cuff national commentary for no obvious reason, especially since here it is almost invariably stupid.

I don't know why we need need human villains for our morass. Torts/Old Guard/Fletcher/Hextall/fans etc. etc. Couldn't the system be set up in a flawed way and be the culprit?

Look at some of the factors that determine the behavior of Comcast.

1 Like almost all NHL franchises, heavily dependent on tix revenue. Full scale rebuild would be costly for sure with very uncertain rewards.

2. Unlike all NHL franchises, arena situated in an "entertainment center" (Xfinity Live). Low tix sales => low vendor sales => lower rent. Further loss of revenue.

3. Most important tenant (Sixers) threatening to leave in 7 years time. The most severe crisis in the history of Comcast Spectacor. Tenant been offered part ownership stake (according to some reports as high as 40%). This stake is worth less if leases are rentable for less, which means tenant even less likely to accept.

4. Flyers provide tv programming for 41 games a year + preseason + numerous shows/discussions. Advertising drop if interest wanes, less lead in to other programs.

5. Had almost identical situation with Sixers. Team was stuck in a mediocre path, Comcast refused to do a full scale tear it down style rebuild (which finally happened after Josh Harris bought the team). So, we have precedence about how Comcast operates re: sports teams it owns.

All in all, strong economic incentives to not do full scale rebuild, many multiples of those for other franchises.

In this regard, I think guys like Clarke, Tortorella, die hard fans etc play the role of useful idiots. Ownership lets them have their say because what they espouse is exactly what is best for economic interests.
- PT21

and how are the Sixers attendance, ratings and merchandise sales post tank

You won’t get a potential game changer with a late 1st. You may get an already somewhat proven youngish player with some upside. That is likely further along than at late 1st who could be years away.
- furio16

That’s why I like to hear names… I agree on the assessment that those particular picks aren’t getting you game changers… but maybe a mix of draft picks, current assets and cap$ gets you to a guy like that.

If I'm trading the 2 1sts it's for something better. Flyers already have 2nd pair dmen (skill wise) in Sanheim and York. Frost could still be a 2c.
- Pelle31Forever

York is a 2 dman

You mean the guy who inherited an economic crisis that was the greatest since the great depression and put together a bipartisan team of economists who brought about a recovery far quicker than any other country on earth was able to do? The guy who passed the most sweeping domestic legislation in the US in the past 50 years, fighting both extreme political opposition and public opinion to a present situation where it is now very solidly popular for many years?

I don't understand this penchant for off the cuff national commentary for no obvious reason, especially since here it is almost invariably stupid.
- PT21

I don’t tend to get political but if you’d like I could list what Obama ran on (the change) and what actually got accomplished but I will warn you it doesn’t end good for Obama. And I don’t blame him at all. No president can deliver the ridiculous “change” and campaign promises. Not in today’s politics.

You mean the guy who inherited an economic crisis that was the greatest since the great depression and put together a bipartisan team of economists who brought about a recovery far quicker than any other country on earth was able to do? The guy who passed the most sweeping domestic legislation in the US in the past 50 years, fighting both extreme political opposition and public opinion to a present situation where it is now very solidly popular for many years?

I don't understand this penchant for off the cuff national commentary for no obvious reason, especially since here it is almost invariably stupid.
- PT21

That isn’t the only thing you don’t understand. Your pretty much wrong about most everything.