If he in fact orchestrated the thing, then he would likely be found guilty, correct? If he is found innocent and he can get his game at a level of a team having interest. He will get an opportunity in the future. Part of having a moral standard is that someone found not guilty shouldn't be treated as guilty.
- MJL

well said

It won’t happen. No owner wants to deal with that. Innocent of a crime or not he orchestrated the thing and it’s not worth the hassle for a pedestrian goalie.

Regardless of that try to have some moral standards.
- hereticpride

I haven’t read anywhere that he orchestrated anything but maybe you know something I don’t. If anything it’s that he didn’t take action to stop what was going on. Team really did well after that pedestrian goalie left didn’t they?. Had to ride Sam into the ground when they had a solid tandem.

when carter hart is eventually cleared does he have a path back to the flyers?
- hello it's me 2050

If he’s cleared then there’s easily a way back to the NHL. Look at Logan Mailloux. Now, a way back to the Flyers? I have my doubts. He’s a RFA this summer and an UFA next summer. So even if the Flyers tendered him a qualifying offer and the NHL allowed them to bury it like they did this season, he’d still be an UFA next summer as the deal wasn’t tolled. There will be plenty of teams in need of a goalie that will offer him a deal. He probably won’t even need to take the league minimum.

again they tried to hold on to him. why does that get lost? trading him wasn't his first choice.

end of the day the deal is fine. also amazes me now how losing walker killed the season.
- hello it's me 2050

The team just didn’t have the depth to recover from losing one of their top d and replacing him with Johnson. You could see they missed him as soon as he was dealt.

It will be verbatim. We should have a drinking game. Take a shot for every one we check off. Nobody will be left to post anything.

- MBFlyerfan

Cirrhosis is a terrible way to go. Everyone's liver would be pickled 10 minutes in.

The team just didn’t have the depth to recover from losing one of their top d and replacing him with Johnson. You could see they missed him as soon as he was dealt.
- Hextall271

missed yes, reason why season wen down the tubes no.

also how did seeler look after walker was dealt.

It’s a good point. This isn’t supposed to be a strong draft. Even if they re sign him without a ntc or nmc it’s fine. Teams are going to come looking to get him on the cheap which is suspect that they already have tried and db should hold out for an overpay. As I mentioned getting rid of him for nothing just to shed salary and to bottom out in the standings isn’t wise.
- Hextall271

When they say it isnt a strong draft. Does that mean it isnt deep? or the 10th pick is equivalent to the 20th pick in most years. And if it isnt strong, does it make sense moving up in the draft this year, if its weak at top end talent? I want no part of moving up this year, unless its 1 or two spots, or the #1 pick, but dont want to move to 5-10. Dont see the reward equaling the expense

I disagree that he didn't do anything. He cleared up the cap and rebuilt the prospect base. Why is the example of Vegas always brought up? They used the expansion draft and took advantage of teams that didn't handle that well as a big part of building their team. It is not a repeatable scenario.
- MJL

I refer to Vegas in that they’ve traded many of their draft picks and prospects away to win immediately. It’s similar to what Homer did as GM.

As for Hextall, he just basically waited out some of those deals to clear cap space. And then used it on JVR. He tried to remain competitive by keeping veterans rather than trading them off to acquire picks and prospects. He wasted the primes of Giroux, Voracek, and Simmonds.

I haven’t read anywhere that he orchestrated anything but maybe you know something I don’t. If anything it’s that he didn’t take action to stop what was going on. Team really did well after that pedestrian goalie left didn’t they?. Had to ride Sam into the ground when they had a solid tandem.
- Hextall271

To my knowledge, nobody ever stated that Hart was pedestrian. Are you in favor of trading Konecny? If so why?

If we’re going to criticize db for non moves we should give him kudos for when he’s done a good job. Walker is an example of a good job. He weaponized the cap space to eventually get a first pick out of it and he didn’t hold on to him to make the playoffs. That decision basically ended the season and that’s fine but good on him
- Hextall271

Maybe I worded that a bit harsh. It ended up being really good for sure. They saw something and it worked out well. Not trying to slight DB. More just saying that if you get someone that turns into a real asset and you can get a 1st you do the deal 99% of the time.

The part of this I worry about it the rumors the Flyers were trying to extend him. They got a 1st so well done.

To my knowledge, nobody ever stated that Hart was pedestrian. Are you in favor of trading Konecny? If so why?
- MJL

I was responding to a poster who literally. Called him pedestrian.

I am if we get proper value. Because he’s too old to sign for what he’s asking. I’m just not ready to get rid of him just to get rid of him. He has value.

When they say it isnt a strong draft. Does that mean it isnt deep? or the 10th pick is equivalent to the 20th pick in most years. And if it isnt strong, does it make sense moving up in the draft this year, if its weak at top end talent? I want no part of moving up this year, unless its 1 or two spots, or the #1 pick, but dont want to move to 5-10. Dont see the reward equaling the expense
- bradster

A lot of the time people label a draft weak when there’s not a Bedard type player in the draft. Sometimes they label it weak because there’s not a lot of high end depth.

This draft is thin at center which is why some consider it weak. But many people believe there are several defenseman who have #1 upside. So this draft is actually expected to be pretty good for defense but it’s a bit thinner at forward.

Whereas 2025 currently appears to be much deeper at center but thinner at defense at the top of the draft. But many consider 2025 to be overall deeper. So pick 20 in 2025 would likely net you a better player than pick 20 in 2024.

I refer to Vegas in that they’ve traded many of their draft picks and prospects away to win immediately. It’s similar to what Homer did as GM.


- Schmojo

Without the base they obtained with leverage and from the expansion draft, it wouldn't have happened. It's not at all similar to what Holmgren did.

As for Hextall, he just basically waited out some of those deals to clear cap space. And then used it on JVR. He tried to remain competitive by keeping veterans rather than trading them off to acquire picks and prospects. He wasted the primes of Giroux, Voracek, and Simmonds.
- Schmojo

Hextall made his share of mistakes but he also did a lot to help the team and left them in a better spot when he left then when he started. Those deals include trading Schenn for 2 firsts. Trading Timonen for a 2nd. Getting Lacavalier, Pronger and Grossman off of the cap in trades. Getting a first for Coburn along with Radko Gudas. That's not just waiting out deals

Maybe I worded that a bit harsh. It ended up being really good for sure. They saw something and it worked out well. Not trying to slight DB. More just saying that if you get someone that turns into a real asset and you can get a 1st you do the deal 99% of the time.

The part of this I worry about it the rumors the Flyers were trying to extend him. They got a 1st so well done.
- Flyfly

I agree with your worry. In a podcast, Briere said he didn’t like having to trade Walker and hopes he doesn’t have to make a trade like that again. That is very concerning.

I agree with your worry. In a podcast, Briere said he didn’t like having to trade Walker and hopes he doesn’t have to make a trade like that again. That is very concerning.
- Schmojo

Agreed, that is not what I want to hear. I'll give them kudos for identifying a guy that had not been healthy. They took a chance and he turned out to be an asset at the TDL. Interested to see where Walker lands.

Without the base they obtained with leverage and from the expansion draft, it wouldn't have happened. It's not at all similar to what Holmgren did.




Hextall made his share of mistakes but he also did a lot to help the team and left them in a better spot when he left then when he started. Those deals include trading Schenn for 2 firsts. Trading Timonen for a 2nd. Getting Lacavalier, Pronger and Grossman off of the cap in trades. Getting a first for Coburn along with Radko Gudas. That's not just waiting out deals
- MJL

does it ever end with your defense of your dad?

trading vinny was easy. because vinny allowed it. so how much did the saint really have to do in that deal? pronger also an easy deal knowing zona is a cap dumb heaven. Grossman also not this great amazing look what I did trade.

kimmo good trade. schenn is arguable depending what way you look at it.

at the nhgl level he sucked cliff. except it.

I was responding to a poster who literally. Called him pedestrian.

I am if we get proper value. Because he’s too old to sign for what he’s asking. I’m just not ready to get rid of him just to get rid of him. He has value.
- Hextall271

The reason why myself and others suggested that the Flyers should trade Hart, was not that he was pedestrian. It was for some of the same reasoning as why they should trade Konecny. He was not worth what it would take to re-sign him, for the a team in the Flyer's position.

CoGM DB will probably sleep a lot better at night once the extension is done. He is mandated to spend to the cap and this new deal will represent a nice size chunk of it.

Without the base they obtained with leverage and from the expansion draft, it wouldn't have happened. It's not at all similar to what Holmgren did.




Hextall made his share of mistakes but he also did a lot to help the team and left them in a better spot when he left then when he started. Those deals include trading Schenn for 2 firsts. Trading Timonen for a 2nd. Getting Lacavalier, Pronger and Grossman off of the cap in trades. Getting a first for Coburn along with Radko Gudas. That's not just waiting out deals
- MJL

It’s exactly what Homer did. From 2008 to 2010 the Flyers made 1 pick in the first 2 rounds. That pick, Sbisa, was traded away a year later to get Pronger. Homer also traded away their own 1st, 2nd, & 3rd in 2011. That’s exactly the way Vegas has been operating.

Hextall did not leave them in a better spot. They were in a much worse spot when he was fired. The team talent level was inferior and he had wasted the primes of their best players. The total return for G, Voracek, and Simmonds is so awful compared to what they could have gotten moving on from them starting in 2014.

It’s exactly what Homer did. From 2008 to 2010 the Flyers made 1 pick in the first 2 rounds. That pick, Sbisa, was traded away a year later to get Pronger. Homer also traded away their own 1st, 2nd, & 3rd in 2011. That’s exactly the way Vegas has been operating.


- Schmojo

If it's exactly what Holmgren did, when did Holmgren use the expansion draft to build a large part of the base of the team?

He did not leave them in a better spot. They were in a much worse spot when he was fired. The team talent level was inferior and he had wasted the primes of their best players. The total return for G, Voracek, and Simmonds is so awful compared to what they could have gotten moving on from them starting in 2014.
- Schmojo

That's false. They were in a much better cap position and the prospect base was one of the highest rated in hockey when he left. When he was hired, the cap was a mess and the prospect base was bare. You know full well that upper management would have never approved or allowed Hextall to completely blow it up when he was hired in 2014. You're not being objective if you blame Hextall for not immediately trading those players.

Maybe I worded that a bit harsh. It ended up being really good for sure. They saw something and it worked out well. Not trying to slight DB. More just saying that if you get someone that turns into a real asset and you can get a 1st you do the deal 99% of the time.

The part of this I worry about it the rumors the Flyers were trying to extend him. They got a 1st so well done.
- Flyfly

Gotcha. That does worry me to. I never saw anywhere where db said we couldn’t sign him so we had to deal him but regardless the right call was made.

TK has trade value. TK is one of our best players. TK is a 30-ish goal scorer.

If another team wants TK as part of a package for a 1st round pick (24 or 25) or young NHL prospect (center??) then I listen.

I am not actively shopping one of my top scorers because his agent asked for $10mil.

Flyers will resign him at $8.5 or $9 for those 8 years. He'll be a 60-70 point guy for most of those years. He's a complimentary piece for the Cup team.

The reason why myself and others suggested that the Flyers should trade Hart, was not that he was pedestrian. It was for some of the same reasoning as why they should trade Konecny. He was not worth what it would take to re-sign him, for the a team in the Flyer's position.
- MJL

Oh we’ve disused this a lot before and I know your take and you know mine. My only hope is that db doesn’t trade tk for a song and I dont think he will. The only scenario which is unacceptable on my view is an overpay resign with a ntc nmc. You can’t have that. If they re sign him to good value, they can flip him to a contender and really fleece them. Say a first a second and a couple of top prospects ( a centre and a dman). Might be a lot but teams get desperate. Now you’re talking.

If it's exactly what Holmgren did, when did Holmgren use the expansion draft to build a large part of the base of the team?




That's false. They were in a much better cap position and the prospect base was one of the highest rated in hockey when he left. When he was hired, the cap was a mess and the prospect base was bare. You know full well that upper management would have never approved or allowed Hextall to completely blow it up when he was hired in 2014. You're not being objective if you blame Hextall for not immediately trading those players.
- MJL

When he was fired the cap was not in this state of hell and the priority was acquiring young players and assets. The new watch cost us 3 or 4 years of spinning tires because of trades like RR. Even if a lot of the picks didn’t pan out, we weren’t sending picks out the door .

Oh we’ve disused this a lot before and I know your take and you know mine. My only hope is that db doesn’t trade tk for a song and I dont think he will. The only scenario which is unacceptable on my view is an overpay resign with a ntc nmc. You can’t have that. If they re sign him to good value, they can flip him to a contender and really fleece them. Say a first a second and a couple of top prospects ( a centre and a dman). Might be a lot but teams get desperate. Now you’re talking.
- Hextall271

This is the dilemma. Is it better to have TK for $9 mil for 8 or trade him for a late 1st?

The way we have been developing players...

Cap goes up so we will start to see more 30 goal guys around $8-9.