His value is what the market says it is.

And such, we have been presented with his value in real time.

Think cong posted it yesterday on how his particular perceived value deteriorated year over year from the instant he was drafted. Some guys it goes up. Some go down.

We also got a 2019 4th overall for a 2017 8th overall.
- TheSabresTaco

If his market was a 3C, then you 100% keep him.

And those two are much closer than 9OA for 40OA as well, so not sure Mitts/Byram applies. Still not a fan of that trade either, but it is what it is, at least someone of value was brought in.

That or the other prospects have taken off? I’ve seen you rave about Rosen’s 200 foot game. Kulich’s offense is on par with Savoie’s. Wahlberg is something different than both of those guys. After that, you start to get into guys that wouldn’t have landed McLoed.
- SDSabre

Yes I raved about Rosens game and I still would have given him up over Savoie.

I've heard no one complain about the players they acquired, just the trade cost of 2 guys. Even the biggest KA die hards know they overpaid.

Do bottom half additions fix everything? That seems like a different question entirely.
- Lunaion

At this point, I don't think there are any KA die hards. Defending a trade or his moves to completely overhaul the bottom 6 doesn't make people a fan of the GM. Personally speaking, there were identifiable holes or issues and I think he addressed many of them.

I've heard no one complain about the players they acquired, just the trade cost of 2 guys. Even the biggest KA die hards know they overpaid.

Do bottom half additions fix everything? That seems like a different question entirely.
- Lunaion

Absolute speculation and you won't be able to prove otherwise today.

This swill of an opinion has been hand crafted from Terry's Sabres feeding you a line of utter bullsh1t since 2012, that prospects are king and everything is fine because we have the best prospects.

If his market was a 3C, then you 100% keep him.

And those two are much closer than 9OA for 40OA as well, so not sure Mitts/Byram applies. Still not a fan of that trade either, but it is what it is, at least someone of value was brought in.
- QuinnFan

The fascination with draft position (or worse, pre-draft rankings) is mind-numbing. We just saw Savoie passed in the prospect pool by the last two #1 picks, and even last year's second round pick.

Hmmm, ok. Again, part of this is his own doing, and I get that. But geez, the guy saw the market and then made his moves. I get the sentiment, but at the same time, people here were losing their minds on June 28th when he hadn't made moves. I was getting killed for saying "wait until july 2nd to start grading him", but here we are having people argue that he should have waited it out deep into the summer.
- Slump Buster

Like I said I am done talking about Savoie, I hope McLeod works and is a piece to the puzzle for a long time.

Yep, hope it works
- Buff36

As do I. The parts are fine. I'm more concerned about the sum.

Yes I raved about Rosens game and I still would have given him up over Savoie.
- Buff36

And Helanous, or Kulich, or Wahlberg? If not, then Savoie would be your theoretical #4. At what point does it end. If you want to talk actual squandered poop, fine, this is a play for an actual NHL need. We all hope it works out.

If his market was a 3C, then you 100% keep him.

And those two are much closer than 9OA for 40OA as well, so not sure Mitts/Byram applies. Still not a fan of that trade either, but it is what it is, at least someone of value was brought in.
- QuinnFan

Why doesn't Ryan McLeod have value?

As do I. The parts are fine. I'm more concerned about the sum.
- TheSabresTaco

I like the speed he has brought in, think we can finally play a game that's needed. And Lindy will help with that. But damn we better stay Healthy, and I really hope he gives Kulich a fair shot.

Like I said I am done talking about Savoie, I hope McLeod works and is a piece to the puzzle for a long time.
- Buff36

Not really. Savoie had value and players of his draft status and performance have garnered bigger returns in the past. As an example, the Sabres will trade Savoie for McLeod. The Knights traded Brannstrom for Stone. Unfortunately, our return seems amazingly lop sided when comparing to like trades.
- QuinnFan

Ottawa recieves
Erik Branstrom (1st round pick)
Oscar Lindberg (2nd round pick)
2020 Second-Round Pick

Vegas Golden Knights
RECEIVE
Mark Stone (0.93 pts/game since trade, 27 years old, $9.5m cap hit)
Tobias Lindberg

Like I said I am done talking about Savoie, I hope McLeod works and is a piece to the puzzle for a long time.
- Buff36

But the question isn't even so much about Savoie. People here didn't like his other trade as well. Would you have urged Adams not to make those trades in order to maximize the value of every asset? I think that is the real question here. Given the context of the last 2 years, the status of the market (its a seller's market), etc. Should he have have sat tight?

Absolute speculation and you won't be able to prove otherwise today.

This swill of an opinion has been hand crafted from Terry's Sabres feeding you a line of utter bullsh1t since 2012, that prospects are king and everything is fine because we have the best prospects.
- TheSabresTaco

and you can prove that?

This is getting silly.

I like the speed he has brought in, think we can finally play a game that's needed. And Lindy will help with that. But damn we better stay Healthy, and I really hope he gives Kulich a fair shot.
- Buff36

They all had their shot in camp. Benson used his. Rosen played a pretty good 200' game with no offensive generation, Kulich did (frank)ing nothing and Savoie hurt himself for the umpteenth time.

Not really. Savoie had value and players of his draft status and performance have garnered bigger returns in the past. As an example, the Sabres will trade Savoie for McLeod. The Knights traded Brannstrom for Stone. Unfortunately, our return seems amazingly lop sided when comparing to like trades.
- QuinnFan

First that was a package deal at the deadline, second maybe GMs are starting to realize overagers in juniors aren't as valuable anymore?

Brannstrom and all of his 7 goals in 266 NHL games? Prospects just aren't worth what we want them to be worth, especially if its our own.

and you can prove that?

This is getting silly.
- Lunaion

your opinion is that they overpaid. my opinion is that they paid market value.

I'm just doing my part in dispelling some notion that Ryan McLeod is this worthless Cody Eakin clown and Savoie is the best prospect in hockey. The hyperbole is tiresome.

Could someone tell me why savoie is perceived to have such a high value by both Sabres and oilers fan bases?

Outside of draft position, he’s done absolutely nothing but beat up on kids 3-4 years younger than him and still getting injured.

Benson made savoie redundant, the rest of the GM apparently don’t think savoie was worth that much and we got a fantastic player in our second to last major area of need.

But the question isn't even so much about Savoie. People here didn't like his other trade as well. Would you have urged Adams not to make those trades in order to maximize the value of every asset? I think that is the real question here. Given the context of the last 2 years, the status of the market (its a seller's market), etc. Should he have have sat tight?
- Slump Buster

Well I think his trade back screwed up another trade and then he doubled up and used a 2nd rnd pick on a player he probably could have gotten for one of our 4ths or waivers.

was literally about to write this. I was going with female doges though.
- TheSabresTaco

I like cun*s

But not these whiny cun*s

They all had their shot in camp. Benson used his. Rosen played a pretty good 200' game with no offensive generation, Kulich did (frank)ing nothing and Savoie hurt himself for the umpteenth time.
- TheSabresTaco

1. Buffalo Sabres
Previous Ranking: 1

Top Five Prospects: Jiri Kulich, Noah Östlund, Matthew Savoie, Devon Levi, Isak Rosen

The Buffalo Sabres are the envy of the league at this point, with an embarrassment of riches on their NHL roster with guys like Rasmus Dahlin and Owen Power holding down the fort on the backend and both Tage Thompson and Dylan Cozens looking like excellent top-six centermen for the next decade. They have already seen many great prospects graduate into big NHL roles and they still have the best group of prospects in the league for my money.

If his market was a 3C, then you 100% keep him.

And those two are much closer than 9OA for 40OA as well, so not sure Mitts/Byram applies. Still not a fan of that trade either, but it is what it is, at least someone of value was brought in.
- QuinnFan

Prospects devalue as time goes on unless they are playing in the NHL. Savoie wasn’t making this roster this year so his value will only go down. If he gets hurt one more time his value is getting girgensens back.

This is a gamble and honestly I think we look at this trade in two years and laugh

Could someone tell me why savoie is perceived to have such a high value by both Sabres and oilers fan bases?

Outside of draft position, he’s done absolutely nothing but beat up on kids 3-4 years younger than him and still getting injured.

Benson made savoie redundant, the rest of the GM apparently don’t think savoie was worth that much and we got a fantastic player in our second to last major area of need.
- Shadman306

The Oilers are looking at the junior offense and the draft position. They have a feeding tube of high octane offense by their big 2 and see little to no value in the 30 point guy. Anyone that spends more than 2 minutes looking under the hood knows that neither is true and are more similar in total provided value than some are willing to admit.

The Oilers are looking at the junior offense and the draft position. They have a feeding tube of high octane offense by their big 2 and see little to no value in the 30 point guy. Anyone that spends more than 2 minutes looking under the hood knows that neither is true and are more similar in total provided value than some are willing to admit.
- TheSabresTaco

Under the Hood! Interesting