Take Schaeffer - and you have your Left D in great shape, in that scenario.

What does the Hawks do if Islanders take hagens San Jose takes Misa and Shaffer is at 3rd at 3?
- Scott1977

Most think he's the best player in the draft, so my answer always is you draft the best player available.

That being said, I'm guessing if that's the case, you could get a haul to move down a few spots so you could get a Martone or Frondell, plus a good young player.

Either way a good thing. I'm not worried about having too many very good Dmen, some of those will turn into good young F's in trades. However, you better have great development people in your organization who gets to know these guys, and know at the point you start trading them which ones will be the best of the group.

All that being said, Shaffer never gets past San Jose, he's exactly what they are looking for in the draft. If your Hagens scenario to NYI happens, Misa is ours.

How much money did Marner lose in FA this past week

How much money did Marner lose in FA this past week
- vabeachbear

My guess, not much. We always see some team spend silly money on players.

How much money did Marner lose in FA this past week
- vabeachbear

He didn't lose a penny. He is going to be the highest paid UFA of this era. He will have 10+ teams to pick from. Panarin signed for $12.2 for 7 and Marner will pass that. You can't win in the playoffs without making the playoffs. Most franchises are trying to get into the playoffs with a chance to win the Cup. Few owners will put up with a decade of no playoffs like the one in Chicago. Many of the owners are hard charging self made billionaires who demand success now. The Leafs are like the Jets of the 80's, a very good team that ended up losing to the eventual Cup Champion most years. Marner has had 63 points in 70 playoff games. He's 28. Rarely misses any time with injury. 2-way player. Toronto management never figured out how to build a winner around their stars. Who has been Toronto's #1 Dman for the past 9 years? On how many teams in the NHL would Morgan Rielly be #1? Now look at what Zito has done. He has 3 guys that would be #1 D men on a lot of teams in Forsling, Ekblad, and Jones.

What does the Hawks do if Islanders take hagens San Jose takes Misa and Shaffer is at 3rd at 3?
- Scott1977

That would still be a win for the Hawks

Aku Raty signed a 2 year deal to play in Finland. Another KD fail, Raty was the key to this rebuild.

He didn't lose a penny. He is going to be the highest paid UFA of this era. He will have 10+ teams to pick from. Panarin signed for $12.2 for 7 and Marner will pass that. You can't win in the playoffs without making the playoffs. Most franchises are trying to get into the playoffs with a chance to win the Cup. Few owners will put up with a decade of no playoffs like the one in Chicago. Many of the owners are hard charging self made billionaires who demand success now. The Leafs are like the Jets of the 80's, a very good team that ended up losing to the eventual Cup Champion most years. Marner has had 63 points in 70 playoff games. He's 28. Rarely misses any time with injury. 2-way player. Toronto management never figured out how to build a winner around their stars. Who has been Toronto's #1 Dman for the past 9 years? On how many teams in the NHL would Morgan Rielly be #1? Now look at what Zito has done. He has 3 guys that would be #1 D men on a lot of teams in Forsling, Ekblad, and Jones.
- stevefrmglencoe

The one thing is that he won't ever be worth the 12M+. He has had some fine seasons sure, but he has the benefit of playing with one of the best goal scoring forwards we'll ever see. He was really awful in the 4 nations faceoff best on best. Over the last several seasons of game 5-7s with the Leafs, he has scored like a 4th line forward despite the opportunities and PP time.

Through the 20 games the Leafs have played when the chips are down.

Nylander 20 GP 8G 8A 16P
Matthews 18 GP 8G 4A 12P
Tavares GP 17 5G 5A 10P

***Marner 20GP 0G 7A 7P***


That's a 6 year span of not being the guy when it mattered which has been a pattern for him. He has some skill and can produce in the regular season, but conventional wisdom would tell you, to be a top paid player you need to show up when push comes to shove. He doesn't and it's not the D or the rest of the team. He is by far the worst producer of the top Leaf's players when they need him.

What does the Hawks do if Islanders take hagens San Jose takes Misa and Shaffer is at 3rd at 3?
- Scott1977

If New York selects Hagens, San Jose will pick Schaefer because they desperately need a top end defenseman.

How much money did Marner lose in FA this past week
- vabeachbear

Some dumb GM will overlook the fact Marner can’t raise his game when it matters and over pay him and give him $14M for seven years with a full NMC. That team will get in the playoffs, Marner will do his Ice Capades routine and become that team’s whipping boy. Let’s hope it’s not our GM signing him.

What does the Hawks do if Islanders take hagens San Jose takes Misa and Shaffer is at 3rd at 3?
- Scott1977

They run up to the podium and take Schaefer.

Some dumb GM will overlook the fact Marner can’t raise his game when it matters and over pay him and give him $14M for seven years with a full NMC. That team will get in the playoffs, Marner will do his Ice Capades routine and become that team’s whipping boy. Let’s hope it’s not our GM signing him.
- paulr

The average tenure for an NHL GM is less than 5 years. They will line up with private planes on July 1. Signing Marner and getting into the playoffs will extend a GM's reign. Let's hope he doesn't end up in the Central and the Hawks playoff drought gets closer to 20 years.

The average tenure for an NHL GM is less than 5 years. They will line up with private planes on July 1. Signing Marner and getting into the playoffs will extend a GM's reign. Let's hope he doesn't end up in the Central and the Hawks playoff drought gets closer to 20 years.
- stevefrmglencoe

I don’t care who signs Marner, so long as it isn’t KD.

Some dumb GM will overlook the fact Marner can’t raise his game when it matters and over pay him and give him $14M for seven years with a full NMC. That team will get in the playoffs, Marner will do his Ice Capades routine and become that team’s whipping boy. Let’s hope it’s not our GM signing him.
- paulr

I figure it will be a bubble team on the long rebuild, like Detroit or Buffalo that back up the Brinks truck for him. Places where the GM may be on a short leash.

The one thing is that he won't ever be worth the 12M+. He has had some fine seasons sure, but he has the benefit of playing with one of the best goal scoring forwards we'll ever see. He was really awful in the 4 nations faceoff best on best. Over the last several seasons of game 5-7s with the Leafs, he has scored like a 4th line forward despite the opportunities and PP time.

Through the 20 games the Leafs have played when the chips are down.

Nylander 20 GP 8G 8A 16P
Matthews 18 GP 8G 4A 12P
Tavares GP 17 5G 5A 10P

***Marner 20GP 0G 7A 7P***


That's a 6 year span of not being the guy when it mattered which has been a pattern for him. He has some skill and can produce in the regular season, but conventional wisdom would tell you, to be a top paid player you need to show up when push comes to shove. He doesn't and it's not the D or the rest of the team. He is by far the worst producer of the top Leaf's players when they need him.
- breadbag

Yes. Also yes and yes.

The one thing is that he won't ever be worth the 12M+. He has had some fine seasons sure, but he has the benefit of playing with one of the best goal scoring forwards we'll ever see. He was really awful in the 4 nations faceoff best on best. Over the last several seasons of game 5-7s with the Leafs, he has scored like a 4th line forward despite the opportunities and PP time.

Through the 20 games the Leafs have played when the chips are down.

Nylander 20 GP 8G 8A 16P
Matthews 18 GP 8G 4A 12P
Tavares GP 17 5G 5A 10P

***Marner 20GP 0G 7A 7P***


That's a 6 year span of not being the guy when it mattered which has been a pattern for him. He has some skill and can produce in the regular season, but conventional wisdom would tell you, to be a top paid player you need to show up when push comes to shove. He doesn't and it's not the D or the rest of the team. He is by far the worst producer of the top Leaf's players when they need him.
- breadbag

He needs to get out of Toronto, away from that media circus. It's the NHL equivalent of what ballplayers deal with in NY. I don't think playing for Babcock earlier in his career did him any favors, either.

I'm not sure of the "product of his environment" argument. We all believed it when Panarin left here, that he'd never produce like he did with Kaner, and we were proven wrong. And the argument was made again with Rantanen, that he needed MacKinnon to put up those stats. I'm sure if he ends up with another good forward group, he'll produce and defend like before.

I have to wonder how much the loss of Stolarz cost the Leafs that series. The TO scribes can write all they want about Marner and their defenders, but losing the #1 goalie is often fatal to a team's chances. Bennett will probably have to answer the bell when he faces the Leafs next regular season.

The average tenure for an NHL GM is less than 5 years. They will line up with private planes on July 1. Signing Marner and getting into the playoffs will extend a GM's reign. Let's hope he doesn't end up in the Central and the Hawks playoff drought gets closer to 20 years.
- stevefrmglencoe

Yea but it really doesn't mean GMs know what they are doing. As a long suffering Cubs fan i saw many many many years of just throwing money at free agents and they still sucked.

If the Blackhawks could sign him for $10 mil or less I'd seriously consider it, he's a player that will help you get to the playoffs, but if you want to win in the playoffs they need to keep developing talent around him. The one fact remains typically the healthier/ deeper/ more talented teams are the ones that go to the final 4. Over $10 mil pass

I imagine the Avs had no idea Stars would end up with Rantanen, but they did and that Stars team is deep in talent before the trade, drafted well, developed well, FA signings, and trades, unlike the Leafs.

I'm looking forward to next season but the season after is the one where i think we begin to see KDs vision on the ice. The end of this season we got a glimpse

Unless there is a significant change I expect Knight to be the Hawks #1 goalie for the next decade (ish). I’d be more than happy if either Commesso or Gajan emerged as the #1. That would be a good problem but I don’t expect it.

At the draft, Misa remains my pick for the Hawks at #3 if he’s there. If not I’m leaning towards Desnoyers then Frondell. I’d be happy with either one of those guys. I’d be fine with Hagens too, but not quite as happy as the other 2.

At 25 (or higher if the Hawks move up) I’d like Spence or Nesbitt. William Moore at #34 would be a nice pick-up too.
- DarthKane

You see these guys more than I do and are good at understanding just because a guy is big and can skate doesn't mean he's good at hockey.

He didn't lose a penny. He is going to be the highest paid UFA of this era. He will have 10+ teams to pick from. Panarin signed for $12.2 for 7 and Marner will pass that. You can't win in the playoffs without making the playoffs. Most franchises are trying to get into the playoffs with a chance to win the Cup. Few owners will put up with a decade of no playoffs like the one in Chicago. Many of the owners are hard-charging self made billionaires who demand success now. The Leafs are like the Jets of the 80's, a very good team that ended up losing to the eventual Cup Champion most years. Marner has had 63 points in 70 playoff games. He's 28. Rarely misses any time with injury. 2-way player. Toronto management never figured out how to build a winner around their stars. Who has been Toronto's #1 Dman for the past 9 years? On how many teams in the NHL would Morgan Rielly be #1? Now look at what Zito has done. He has 3 guys that would be #1 D men on a lot of teams in Forsling, Ekblad, and Jones.
- stevefrmglencoe

This is one of the best posts I have seen about Toronto and its struggles in a long time. Could not agree more with all of this.

Teams are going to line up to acquire Marner. I would also imagine, teams are going to be calling Toronto daily to ask about Matthews.

He needs to get out of Toronto, away from that media circus. It's the NHL equivalent of what ballplayers deal with in NY. I don't think playing for Babcock earlier in his career did him any favors, either.

I'm not sure of the "product of his environment" argument. We all believed it when Panarin left here, that he'd never produce like he did with Kaner, and we were proven wrong. And the argument was made again with Rantanen, that he needed MacKinnon to put up those stats. I'm sure if he ends up with another good forward group, he'll produce and defend like before.

I have to wonder how much the loss of Stolarz cost the Leafs that series. The TO scribes can write all they want about Marner and their defenders, but losing the #1 goalie is often fatal to a team's chances. Bennett will probably have to answer the bell when he faces the Leafs next regular season.
- 333inthe3rd

You are right and maybe getting out of Toronto will help him. He still has a lot of years left to play. Maybe the right coach and fit will help him elevate his game in the playoffs.

I just fully believe he will get paid more than he is worth. There are a lot of guys with similar production in the 7-9 million dollar range because they are in-house drafted talent. The big pricy UFA usually doesn't work out being a value.

You are right and maybe getting out of Toronto will help him. He still has a lot of years left to play. Maybe the right coach and fit will help him elevate his game in the playoffs.

I just fully believe he will get paid more than he is worth. There are a lot of guys with similar production in the 7-9 million dollar range because they are in-house drafted talent. The big pricy UFA usually doesn't work out being a value.
- breadbag

Marner in the right environment would add value to a team, the issue is that he would need to be a $9M player surrounded by players like Crosby or Toews in their prime, along with Bolland or Bennett types, and that’s not going to happen, he wants to cash in. Speaking of Bennett, I’d love for KD to somehow acquire his teammate Lundell, what a good 200’ young forward, similar to Bennett, but not as dirty. The Panthers are going to lose Ekblad, maybe a young defenseman plus will entice them, it won’t be cheap.

I just read a mock draft from Clutchpoints. The Hawks select Jack Murtagh 25th, and the Wings select Spence at 13. Nesbitt and Moore were also chosen in the first round.

You are right and maybe getting out of Toronto will help him. He still has a lot of years left to play. Maybe the right coach and fit will help him elevate his game in the playoffs.

I just fully believe he will get paid more than he is worth. There are a lot of guys with similar production in the 7-9 million dollar range because they are in-house drafted talent. The big pricy UFA usually doesn't work out being a value.
- breadbag

I am not convinced either way on if the Hawks should or shouldn't sign him. We know he can produce and we know he can defend. Chemistry is a key component in this, as Carolina and Rantanen have learned. And as the Hawks and Seth Jones learned. A 7 year deal is a marriage pact. The Hawks haven't even hired a new coach yet. Obviously it has to be a good fit there before getting to whether or not a new FA is a fit with the players already on the roster. It's one thing to plug a player into our fantasy rosters, but IRL, these dimensions loom large.

The other part of it is whether or not the Hawks are at the point where it is time to make such an investment on an outside talent. They would also have to know what needs the pipeline probably won't address anytime soon, and it's something that can't be acquired through trade more cheaply and with less risk.

We did luck out with Hossa when he came here. I'm not sure they win three Cups without him on the roster. We saw the drop after he had to retire. Impossible to replace. So there are successes to be had with these marriage pact signings, even if many of them track with the maxim of the two happiest days of a boat owner's life are the day the boat is bought and the day the boat is sold.

I just read a mock draft from Clutchpoints. The Hawks select Jack Murtagh 25th, and the Wings select Spence at 13. Nesbitt and Moore were also chosen in the first round.
- bjphawkfan

Cool