Maybe if Farabee culd actually finish just one of his plehtora of scoring chances and Frost could actually generate offense, the team would have better 5 on 5 numbers.


- jd250

I agree. Same goes for Tippett and Foerster. Along with other players on the team. Your agenda here was not to discuss the Flyers but to dig at something else. Which you tried to do multiple times yesterday. It's not going to work

The Flyers play the EXACT same system as the Hurricanes, the only difference is the Hurricanes have more players that could actually finish a high danger scoring chance. Carolina would have jettisoned stiffs like Frost and Farabee years ago.
- jd250

That is false. This idea that you have stems from a Tortorella press conference in which you completely misrepresented and misunderstood. As you have done numerous times. The Flyers system and the Hurricanes system under Brind A'mour is not remotely the same. Not even close.

That is false. This idea that you have stems from a Tortorella press conference in which you completely misrepresented and misunderstood. As you have done numerous times. The Flyers system and the Hurricanes system under Brind A'mour is not remotely the same. Not even close.
- MJL

Ok, prove it! Tell me how the systems are different.

I think MJL is hoping for the Flyers to fail and fall.
- WhiskeyMan

No, I'm hoping for the Flyers to one day move away from their failed philosophies and strategies and move into the realm of the modern day NHL. In the hopes that they can succeed and hopefully one day win the Stanley Cup in my adult lifetime.

Ok, prove it! Tell me how the systems are different.
- jd250

Sure, right after you prove how they're the same.

I agree. Same goes for Tippett and Foerster. Along with other players on the team. Your agenda here was not to discuss the Flyers but to dig at something else. Which you tried to do multiple times yesterday. It's not going to work

- MJL

I'm digging at the simple truth that I have told you for two years and you have lambasted me on this forum for, that is, Frost is all fluff and no stuff and Farabee is an OK player with OK skill. This has nothing to do with Torts, this is on the players themselves. Too many Flyers' players have gone to the next level under Torts and his staff the past three years, including Sanheim, TK, York, Risto, Andrae, Foerster, Michkov, Cates, Tippet and Brink, not to mention the three young goalies. At some point you need to come on this forum and state you were wrong about Torts, about Risto, about Frost, Farabee .. and I don't know, probably a dozen other things.

Sure, right after you prove how they're the same.
- MJL

The Flyers and Hurricanes both play a forward checking, north/south, above the puck system that emphasizes strong nuetral zone play, 5 man unit puck support in all 3 zones and strong forecheck. Both teams like to force turnovers in the neutral zone. Both teams like their defenseman to pinch. Both teams like to score off the rush.

Let's see, in MJLs world:

1. Risto is a mediocre 3rd pairing defenseman


- jd250

That is correct, he is.

2. Frost is actually a top line center if only he wasn't held back by a secret international conspiracy lead by Torts


- jd250

I have never once in my entire posting history stated that Frost is a top line center in the NHL

3. Farabee is a good goal scorer


- jd250

Farabee is a two time 20 goals scored in the NHL and would've done it a 3rd time if not for injury. That's a good goal scorer. 20 goals scorers are at a premium in the NHL.

4. Torts will ruin Michkov


- jd250

He's the worst development coach you could have for a player like Michkov

5 The Flyers are in 6th place in the Metro

Can't see why anyone would question any of these
- jd250

That's correct, they are in 6th

The Flyers and Hurricanes both play a forward checking, north/south, above the puck system that emphasizes strong nuetral zone play, 5 man unit puck support in all 3 zones and strong forecheck. Both teams like to force turnovers in the neutral zone. Both teams like their defenseman to pinch. Both teams like to score off the rush.
- jd250

None of those terms are descriptions of a hockey system. You can apply those cliches to every team in the league and any team that plays hockey for that matter.

You heard Tortorella make a statement in a press conference that you completely misheard. Now you think that the Flyers and Canes play the exact same system.

Here is one big difference. Under Tortorella, the Flyers play a low ZONE collapse system in the defensive zone. The Canes play MAN TO MAN in the defensive zone. Watching the game, as you so often like to respond to me, would show you that. The Flyers have played the Canes twice this season.

I'm digging at the simple truth that I have told you for two years and you have lambasted me on this forum for, that is, Frost is all fluff and no stuff and Farabee is an OK player with OK skill. This has nothing to do with Torts, this is on the players themselves. Too many Flyers' players have gone to the next level under Torts and his staff the past three years, including Sanheim, TK, York, Risto, Andrae, Foerster, Michkov, Cates, Tippet and Brink, not to mention the three young goalies. At some point you need to come on this forum and state you were wrong about Torts, about Risto, about Frost, Farabee .. and I don't know, probably a dozen other things.
- jd250

The majority of the younger players on the team are struggling offensively this season. Michkov's point success has nothing to do with Tortorella. Michkov is struggling offensively at 5 on 5. Konecny and Sanheim were ascending well before Tortorella arrived. Andrae was deemed not good enough to make the team by Tortorella. We can clearly see what an error in judgement that was. Ristolainen has played well for a handful of games but overall, remains a mediocre overpaid player. He reverted back to the norm the last game against St Louis. Foerster is struggling offensively but he's a 2nd year player. York would be further along quicker if not for Tortorella holding him back in a past season. You haven't proven that I've been wrong about anything.

The majority of the younger players on the team are struggling offensively this season. Michkov's point success has nothing to do with Tortorella. Michkov is struggling offensively at 5 on 5. Konecny and Sanheim were ascending well before Tortorella arrived. Andrae was deemed not good enough to make the team by Tortorella. We can clearly see what an error in judgement that was. Ristolainen has played well for a handful of games but overall, remains a mediocre overpaid player. He reverted back to the norm the last game against St Louis. Foerster is struggling offensively but he's a 2nd year player. York would be further along quicker if not for Tortorella holding him back in a past season. You haven't proven that I've been wrong about anything.
- MJL

Wow so much wrong with that paragraph.

You are really a troll when it comes to trots

The majority of the younger players on the team are struggling offensively this season. Michkov's point success has nothing to do with Tortorella. Michkov is struggling offensively at 5 on 5. Konecny and Sanheim were ascending well before Tortorella arrived. Andrae was deemed not good enough to make the team by Tortorella. We can clearly see what an error in judgement that was. Ristolainen has played well for a handful of games but overall, remains a mediocre overpaid player. He reverted back to the norm the last game against St Louis. Foerster is struggling offensively but he's a 2nd year player. York would be further along quicker if not for Tortorella holding him back in a past season. You haven't proven that I've been wrong about anything.
- MJL

Risto didn't have a bad game last night. You see and hear what you want to, and many times it is utter fantasyland stuff on your part. TK and Sanheim have both grown into men as hockey players under Torts. Michkov is struggling offensively at 5 on 5 cause he is a 19 year old learning the ropes in the NHL. That has NOTHING to do with Torts. I could go on and on here, but why bother. Just false narrative after false narrative from you, but you do you.

Risto didn't have a bad game last night. You see and hear what you want to, and many times it is utter fantasyland stuff on your part. TK and Sanheim have both grown into men as hockey players under Torts. Michkov is struggling offensively at 5 on 5 cause he is a 19 year old learning the ropes in the NHL. That has NOTHING to do with Torts. I could go on and on here, but why bother. Just false narrative after false narrative from you, but you do you.
- Phillywhiteout

👏 👏

Well said

The Ninas with another gem. McCaffrey hurting his vagina when he got the ball toss was too funny. SOFT team! Eh what?

No, I'm hoping for the Flyers to one day move away from their failed philosophies and strategies and move into the realm of the modern day NHL. In the hopes that they can succeed and hopefully one day win the Stanley Cup in my adult lifetime.
- MJL

But they have moved away from it. They are trying to build a team the right way that will compete for a cup, not just make the playoffs. They already have one of the youngest teams in the league yet the recognize they are not close yet. Torts, Jones, Hillary to Briere have said this multiple times. They have done nothing to contradict this. They accumulated 6 picks in this draft and they are clearly developing young players much better than any time in the past two decades. They are not tanking which in the end is the right approach but I do hope they trade some veteran players this deadline to improve their odds at getting another impact player. You just are so caught up in this narrative, that clearly does not fit this current leadership group.

None of those terms are descriptions of a hockey system. You can apply those cliches to every team in the league and any team that plays hockey for that matter.

You heard Tortorella make a statement in a press conference that you completely misheard. Now you think that the Flyers and Canes play the exact same system.

Here is one big difference. Under Tortorella, the Flyers play a low ZONE collapse system in the defensive zone. The Canes play MAN TO MAN in the defensive zone. Watching the game, as you so often like to respond to me, would show you that. The Flyers have played the Canes twice this season.
- MJL

There is no such thing as a low zone collapse defensive system, unless you are referring to the PK or 6v5. The reason why you see the flyers this way too often is because they often lose the possession battle and end up in a long shift where they don’t have the energy to win puck battles, clear the zone and get a line change. It starts with the poor center play on this team, but there are other factors like lack of foot speed to beat the other teams to the puck. The fact that the Flyers block a lot of shots is solely because they have to defend so much and chase the puck, not by design. Carolina has the talent and speed to execute their style of play much better than the Flyers but it does not mean the Flyers are not trying to play the same way. The Flyers are trying to play a modern NHL style of play, they don’t have the horses yet to be able to do it as well as the top teams in the league. However against the middling and lower teams the Flyers actually do quite well.

The majority of the younger players on the team are struggling offensively this season. Michkov's point success has nothing to do with Tortorella. Michkov is struggling offensively at 5 on 5. Konecny and Sanheim were ascending well before Tortorella arrived. Andrae was deemed not good enough to make the team by Tortorella. We can clearly see what an error in judgement that was. Ristolainen has played well for a handful of games but overall, remains a mediocre overpaid player. He reverted back to the norm the last game against St Louis. Foerster is struggling offensively but he's a 2nd year player. York would be further along quicker if not for Tortorella holding him back in a past season. You haven't proven that I've been wrong about anything.
- MJL

Is this a joke? Your ship is sinking rapidly. You need to stop bailing water and abandon ship before you drown. Everything you said here is completely false. Everyone sees the development of both young and veteran players on this team since Torts has arrived. You have no leg to stand on anymore. Example, Michkov is going to win the Calder and you say he is being held back? Well maybe since he is stuck playing with Frost. Sanheim was nothing more than a boy who can skate and now because of Torts’ tough love he is playing like a top pairing defenseman. TK is now the defacto face of the Flyers because of the confidence and patience Torts has given him. I could go on but it won’t matter to you. Why let the facts get in the way of a false narrative.

Positive
- MJL

Didn't know 25 was greater than 27.

But they have moved away from it. They are trying to build a team the right way that will compete for a cup, not just make the playoffs. They already have one of the youngest teams in the league yet the recognize they are not close yet. Torts, Jones, Hillary to Briere have said this multiple times. They have done nothing to contradict this. They accumulated 6 picks in this draft and they are clearly developing young players much better than any time in the past two decades. They are not tanking which in the end is the right approach but I do hope they trade some veteran players this deadline to improve their odds at getting another impact player. You just are so caught up in this narrative, that clearly does not fit this current leadership group.
- jd250

No they haven't. They just temporarily paused due to a lack of cap space and the cap issues caused by the coach. Jones is on record as saying that as soon as they can and the cap clears up. They will use free agency to try and bolster the team. You have given the current leadership the same blind allegiance that you gave Fletcher.

There is no such thing as a low zone collapse defensive system, unless you are referring to the PK or 6v5. The reason why you see the flyers this way too often is because they often lose the possession battle and end up in a long shift where they don’t have the energy to win puck battles, clear the zone and get a line change. It starts with the poor center play on this team, but there are other factors like lack of foot speed to beat the other teams to the puck. The fact that the Flyers block a lot of shots is solely because they have to defend so much and chase the puck, not by design. Carolina has the talent and speed to execute their style of play much better than the Flyers but it does not mean the Flyers are not trying to play the same way. The Flyers are trying to play a modern NHL style of play, they don’t have the horses yet to be able to do it as well as the top teams in the league. However against the middling and lower teams the Flyers actually do quite well.
- jd250

https://www.hockeyshare.com/drill/7043/

https://nhlguides.net/low...collapse/#google_vignette

https://blueseatblogs.com...stability-and-aggression/


Zone/Box+1 – This is a less aggressive zone than the overload, and is often called a low zone collapse. This is your John Tortorella system when he was with the Rangers. Four skaters protect home plate, one follows the puck to apply pressure.

https://playbook7.weebly.com/d-zone-coverage.html

Is this a joke? Your ship is sinking rapidly. You need to stop bailing water and abandon ship before you drown. Everything you said here is completely false. Everyone sees the development of both young and veteran players on this team since Torts has arrived. You have no leg to stand on anymore. Example, Michkov is going to win the Calder and you say he is being held back? Well maybe since he is stuck playing with Frost. Sanheim was nothing more than a boy who can skate and now because of Torts’ tough love he is playing like a top pairing defenseman. TK is now the defacto face of the Flyers because of the confidence and patience Torts has given him. I could go on but it won’t matter to you. Why let the facts get in the way of a false narrative.
- jd250

What I said is that Michkov will be held back. Not that he is being held back currently. The season is long and it's just December. I don't see any facts in your statement. Just conjecture and rhetoric. Sanheim is not playing like a top pairing defenseman. Not quite. I'll remind of your frequent comments, including this season of Sanheim SUCKS,

Didn't know 25 was greater than 27.
- WhiskeyMan

It's not but 25 is more than 23

It's not but 25 is more than 23
- MJL

But by your logic if Columbus is ahead of the Flyers, 25 is more than 27. Or you can't admit you may have been wrong?

The Ninas with another gem. McCaffrey hurting his vagina when he got the ball toss was too funny. SOFT team! Eh what?
- StepfordSam

Typical classless Beagles fan. Guy gets injured and you find it funny. If that injury had happened to your buddy Barkley you'd be cryin in your coffee. If the Beagles had the injuries that the Ninas have sustained this year they would be 2-10 instead of 10-2, but you do you. Folks like you make it easy to root against the Beagles! Eh what??

But by your logic if Columbus is ahead of the Flyers, 25 is more than 27. Or you can't admit you may have been wrong?
- WhiskeyMan

He always kicks and screams like a little girl when the Flyers win. He wants them to completely tank, so that they MAY be good again by the year 2033. Oh, and he will NEVER/EVER admit that he is wrong even though that occurs daily on here. Eh what?

What I said is that Michkov will be held back. Not that he is being held back currently. The season is long and it's just December. I don't see any facts in your statement. Just conjecture and rhetoric. Sanheim is not playing like a top pairing defenseman. Not quite. I'll remind of your frequent comments, including this season of Sanheim SUCKS,
- MJL

He is playing like a top pair defenseman.