Heres the thing though. The flyers could have won with Giroux. Management just made boneheaded trades and signings and didn't give Giroux the support needed. Guys like MacDonald, Lecavalier Eminger were clearly not the answer.

After Hextall took over he further wasted Girouxs career buy moving guys who would help him and keeping them mediocre. Say what you want about the return of the Schenn trade but theres no denying the team would have been better with Schenn in the lineup. Hextall wasted Giroux and Voracek. Both should have been moved if thats the direction hecwanted to go. Neither were spring chickens

Briere right now appears to be doing the same thing as hextall. Only difference is Michkov is a spring chicken and on a elc. He can afford to waste some time but at the end of the day hes going to have to pick a side eventually. Try to win with Michkov or rebuild.

Trying to do both with likely lead us down thecsame path
- xShoot4WarAmpsx

To your points it is safe to say we lost the Schenn trade

You are wrong. They flat out said it.
- psuhockey

Jones has said they will spend when they have the cap space. Sounds like he is talking out both sides of his mouth.

Brandon Manning, Jacob Voracek Radko Gudas Pierre Edward Bellemare, Michael Neuvirth Michael Raffl, Chris VandeVelde.

All signed to multi year deals under Hextall.
- psuhockey

Stop gap players. Voracek was 24 years old. It's speculation but Hextall would not have signed a 27 year old Konecny to an 8 year deal or a Nick Seeler to a 4 year deal with trade protection. Hextall traded vets when they had value at the deadline to acquire future assets. He was legitimately attempting to rebuild as much as management would let him. The current management is just pretending to rebuild and gaslighting their fanbase.

Brandon Manning, Jakub Voracek Radko Gudas Pierre Edward Bellemare, Michael Neuvirth Michael Raffl, Chris VandeVelde.

All signed to multi year deals under Hextall.
- psuhockey

Dale Weiss?

Jones has said they will spend when they have the cap space. Sounds like he is talking out both sides of his mouth.
- furio16

My guess the reason they are saying it is that they think they won’t have capspace until 2026.

Stop gap players. Voracek was 24 years old. It's speculation but Hextall would not have signed a 27 year old Konecny to an 8 year deal or a Nick Seeler to a 4 year deal with trade protection. Hextall traded vets when they had value at the deadline to acquire future assets. He was legitimately attempting to rebuild as much as management would let him. The current management is just pretending to rebuild and gaslighting their fanbase.
- MJL

Hextalls stay in the middle was not rebuilding.

Stop gap players. Voracek was 24 years old. It's speculation but Hextall would not have signed a 27 year old Konecny to an 8 year deal or a Nick Seeler to a 4 year deal with trade protection. Hextall traded vets when they had value at the deadline to acquire future assets. He was legitimately attempting to rebuild as much as management would let him. The current management is just pretending to rebuild and gaslighting their fanbase.
- MJL

Voracek was 26 years old, a year prior to him hitting UFA. It’s the exact same situation except Konecny is one year older. Gudas was signed to a 4 year extension. These are identical comparables.

I guess I’m just not as optimistic about the last few games. the losses to Boston and Utah leave a bad taste in my mouth - I don’t see these “team-building” wins.
- gritty_committee

They blew leads, lost the games. They’re on a 3 game losing streak. Only stellar goaltending kept them from losing some of those games they’ve won. Also, someone pointed out earlier that they e only won 5 games in regulation. Those are not signs of a good team.

Also, yeah, maybe from time to time, a loss can be productive in the grand scheme of things, but these are not those and this is not that type of team (in its current form)

Voracek was 26 years old, a year prior to him hitting UFA. It’s the exact same situation except Konecny is one year older. Gudas was signed to a 4 year extension. These are identical comparables.
- psuhockey

Voracek was 25 when the contract was signed and was coming off a season where he finished 2nd in the NHL in assists and 5th in overall scoring. He was coming into stardom. Konency will be 28 when his deal starts. Significant difference. Hextall also didn't have the young talent to draw from like the current team has. He was left with a team barren of prospect depth. Hextall was legitimately attempting to transform the organization and completely change course in how they operate. Until they lost patience and basically forced him to escalate. The current regime is not rebuilding. It is a pause due to necessity due to past actions and a philosophy of team building that they will undoubtedly return to as soon as they can. Choosing to sign and play vets over young players. A perfect example is Emil Andrae, who has made a legitimate impact on the team. If not for injuries, he would still be in the AHL. Flahr the assistant GM said last year that Andrae was NHL ready. Instead, they had to sign safety blankets in Seeler and Johnson. The mindset between the two situations is completely different.

Voracek was 25 when the contract was signed and was coming off a season where he finished 2nd in the NHL in assists and 5th in overall scoring. He was coming into stardom. Konency will be 28 when his deal starts. Significant difference. Hextall also didn't have the young talent to draw from like the current team has. He was left with a team barren of prospect depth. Hextall was legitimately attempting to transform the organization and completely change course in how they operate. Until they lost patience and basically forced him to escalate. The current regime is not rebuilding. It is a pause due to necessity due to past actions and a philosophy of team building that they will undoubtedly return to as soon as they can.
- MJL

Hextall was also not rebuilding.

Did Hextall not have Simmonds, Couturier, Schenn, Ghost, Jake, and Giroux? Am I missing anyone? Is that not a solid core to build around? Or if not then tear it down? Hextall did neither.

Hextall was also not rebuilding.

Did Hextall not have Simmonds, Couturier, Schenn, Ghost, Jake, and Giroux? Am I missing anyone? Is that not a solid core to build around? Or if not then tear it down? Hextall did neither.
- login

He totally blew it. The mushy middle. Think about the guys he drafted, TK and Sanheim came into their own the last two years. What was the plan there?

He totally blew it. The mushy middle. Think about the guys he drafted, TK and Sanheim came into their own the last two years. What was the plan there?
- ClaudeFather

hysterical to say he was rebuilding when you look at his body of work.

hysterical to say he was rebuilding when you look at his body of work.
- login

JVR lol was that a rebuild

Voracek was 25 when the contract was signed and was coming off a season where he finished 2nd in the NHL in assists and 5th in overall scoring. He was coming into stardom. Konency will be 28 when his deal starts. Significant difference. Hextall also didn't have the young talent to draw from like the current team has. He was left with a team barren of prospect depth. Hextall was legitimately attempting to transform the organization and completely change course in how they operate. Until they lost patience and basically forced him to escalate. The current regime is not rebuilding. It is a pause due to necessity due to past actions and a philosophy of team building that they will undoubtedly return to as soon as they can. Choosing to sign and play vets over young players. A perfect example is Emil Andrae, who has made a legitimate impact on the team. If not for injuries, he would still be in the AHL. Flahr the assistant GM said last year that Andrae was NHL ready. Instead, they had to sign safety blankets in Seeler and Johnson.
- MJL

Voracek’s deal started at 27 years old, one year earlier than Konecny extension will start. It’s nearly an identical situation.

As far as willing to play young players. Lindblom couldn’t get off the 4th line because of the Vandeveldes of the world. And Travis Sanheim was yo-yoed to the AHL because he couldn’t get minutes over Brandon Manning. The situations are identical even down to the old schools coaches who give more minutes to grinders than scorers. At least Tortorella and his staff seem to be able to develop defensemen.

Briere is exactly following Hextall’s plan. The only hope is that he drafts better.

Voracek’s deal started at 27 years old, one year earlier than Konecny extension will start. It’s nearly an identical situation.

As far as willing to play young players. Lindblom couldn’t get off the 4th line because of the Vandeveldes of the world. And Travis Sanheim was yo-yoed to the AHL because he couldn’t get minutes over Brandon Manning. The situations are identical even down to the old schools coaches who give more minutes to grinders than scorers. At least Tortorella and his staff seem to be able to develop defensemen.

Briere is exactly following Hextall’s plan. The only hope is that his drafts better.
- psuhockey

Lindholm and Sanheim were developing young players. It's not identical. Hextall was trying to rebuild. This team isn't. They're only saying they are. Briere wouldn't have gotten the job if he said he wanted to employ a patient rebuild. McDonald, a vet was the player sent down to minors to give Manning, a young player, a spot on the team.
Was Voracek an RFA or a pending UFA when he signed his deal? How about Konecny? There are numerous and significant differences. Time to get back to the current team.

JVR lol was that a rebuild
- ClaudeFather

But Clarke and Holmgren told him to sign JVR. Always an excuse.

Lindholm and Sanheim were developing young players. It's not identical. Hextall was trying to rebuild. This team isn't. They're only saying they are. Briere wouldn't have gotten the job if he said he wanted to employ a patient rebuild. McDonald, a vet was the player sent down to minors to give Manning, a young player, a spot on the team.
Was Voracek an RFA or a pending UFA when he signed his deal? How about Konecny? There are numerous and significant differences. Time to get back to the current team.
- MJL

No he wasn't

Can we talk about how Frost flubbed the game away instead of Hextall? Pretty please!

Michkov is going to end up like Lindros and Giroux. I love(d) watching them play but ultimately will be somewhat disappointed because they will/did not win due to poor front office management.
- mickel25

The issue with Lindros was the fact that the Flyers gave up the farm to get him. As has been discussed before on here, they probably would have won the Cup with Forsberg instead of Lindros based on the fact that they would have stayed status quo. They sill had a good enough team to win it all from 1995-2000, but their goaltending left lots to be desired. Giroux was mismanagement be Hextall. That was all Hextall's fault. Then he spit the bit in Pitt (see what I did there?)!

Can we talk about how Frost flubbed the game away instead of Hextall? Pretty please!
- mickel25

Just a terrible play and inexcusable, however that play alone didn't cost them the game. The play of the Flyers top line and top defense pairing is what really cost them the game. The Frost line was the Flyers best line in the game.

The issue with Lindros was the fact that the Flyers gave up the farm to get him. As has been discussed before on here, they probably would have won the Cup with Forsberg instead of Lindros based on the fact that they would have stayed status quo. They sill had a good enough team to win it all from 1995-2000, but their goaltending left lots to be desired. Giroux was mismanagement be Hextall. That was all Hextall's fault. Then he spit the bit in Pitt (see what I did there?)!
- Phillywhiteout

The Lindros era failed because Clarke didn’t respect defense and goaltending. He put a ton of resources in acquiring forwards and only acquired broken late career defensemen. The Giroux era failed for the same reasons. The reason Holmgren came closest is because of the amount of resources he dumped into the defense. He just ran out of resources and put the team in deep debt. If you believe him, he said a good portion of the league refused to deal with because of the Weber offersheet.

The Lindros era failed because Clarke didn’t respect defense and goaltending. He put a ton of resources in acquiring forwards and only acquired broken late career defensemen. The Giroux era failed for the same reasons. The reason Holmgren came closest is because of the amount of resources he dumped into the defense. He just ran out of resources and put the team in deep debt. If you believe him, he said a good portion of the league refused to deal with because of the Weber offersheet.
- psuhockey

The biggest and most successful trade that Clarke made was the Recchi trade. A trade specifically made to target and acquire Eric Desjardin. Who was 26 at the time and a top 10 NHL defenseman. He also made other trades to acquire NHL defenseman such as Petr Svoboda.

Dale Weiss?
- furio16

➕️ Hakstol. A guy who created a mutiny among the players in Seattle because he was the most boring stick in the mud in NHL coaching history.

The biggest and most successful trade that Clarke made was the Recchi trade. A trade specifically made to target and acquire Eric Desjardin. Who was 26 at the time and a top 10 NHL defenseman. He also made other trades to acquire NHL defenseman such as Petr Svoboda.
- MJL

They did acquire Svoboda and Samuelson, and Richardson, and Markov and McGillis. These were all stiffs. McGillis was the only one to get more than 5 goals in a season. The rest didn’t even break 5. When Chris Therien is the 2nd best defenseman of the roster I don’t consider that respecting the position.

They did acquire Svoboda and Samuelson, and Richardson, and Markov and McGillis. These were all stiffs. McGillis was the only one to get more than 5 goals in a season. The rest didn’t even break 5. When Chris Therien is the 2nd best defenseman of the roster I don’t consider that respecting the position.
- psuhockey

All stiffs. Good stuff. Kevin Haller as well. My bad a stiff.