Bill Meltzer: Development Camp Finale: Scrimmage Day, Fan Fest

First puck to the face gets an ELC

Well this the unofficial ending of the season. Steve Kouleas & Co signed off for the summer. Prospect Camp is done. The 24-25 rosters seem set. There will be some news when Michkov arrives but now time to get ready for NFL training camps in a few weeks. I know there’s a lot of disappointment in the fact the no moves have been made indicating a step forward or a step towards rebuilding. Wait until draft day next year

Well this the unofficial ending of the season. Steve Kouleas & Co signed off for the summer. Prospect Camp is done. The 24-25 rosters seem set. There will be some news when Michkov arrives but now time to get ready for NFL training camps in a few weeks. I know there’s a lot of disappointment in the fact the no moves have been made indicating a step forward or a step towards rebuilding. Wait until draft day next year
- mikeyo27

They aren’t rebuilding
They never rebuild, their ridiculous culture won’t allow it. It’s why they’ve been sailing in the sea of mediocrity for 12 damn years.

Well this the unofficial ending of the season. Steve Kouleas & Co signed off for the summer. Prospect Camp is done. The 24-25 rosters seem set. There will be some news when Michkov arrives but now time to get ready for NFL training camps in a few weeks. I know there’s a lot of disappointment in the fact the no moves have been made indicating a step forward or a step towards rebuilding. Wait until draft day next year
- mikeyo27

The Michkov arrival is something to look forward to for sure. Drafts are not won or lost necessarily this early but I don’t think this is one that will viewed as a great job by the Flyers. Most so called “rebuilding” teams don’t reach for players in the first round or trade 1rst round picks, for future years….What do they do? They actively trade productive vets and ADD 1rst round picks. Lachenko might be a good one and we all hope he is, but the pick at 12 (13) was a reach.
Yes we’ll hear all the talking heads tell us it’s a rebuild and “look we have 3 1rst round picks in a deep draft next year”…that’s it? That’s your rebuild? After watching you clearly stumble in this years draft, I can’t say I’m confident they will get next years right. This organization continues to look inept. Briere doesn’t look like a GM that can get things done unless he’s willing to take bad $ or a horrid contract to get it done. Colour me unimpressed.

The Michkov arrival is something to look forward to for sure. Drafts are not won or lost necessarily this early but I don’t think this is one that will viewed as a great job by the Flyers. Most so called “rebuilding” teams don’t reach for players in the first round or trade 1rst round picks, for future years….What do they do? They actively trade productive vets and ADD 1rst round picks. Lachenko might be a good one and we all hope he is, but the pick at 12 (13) was a reach.
Yes we’ll hear all the talking heads tell us it’s a rebuild and “look we have 3 1rst round picks in a deep draft next year”…that’s it? That’s your rebuild? After watching you clearly stumble in this years draft, I can’t say I’m confident they will get next years right. This organization continues to look inept. Briere doesn’t look like a GM that can get things done unless he’s willing to take bad $ or a horrid contract to get it done. Colour me unimpressed.
- landros2

You keep at this narrative but I just don't believe its fair or accurate. In this draft Briere did try to aggressively trade into the top 10 to get a potential elite talent, which is what rebuilding teams do. Unfortunately other teams were not biting. It takes two teams to make a trade. Its easy for you and I to say, just trade up, or hey Pinto is supposedly available, just get him in a trade. But the reality is 99% of the trade rumors out there are fantasy, just made up for click bait. The fact is its very hard to make a hockey trade, especially when you are Briere and you are dealing from a position of weakness, in that teams know the Flyers ar tight on cap space and are rebuilding, but worse Briere is trying to sell mediocre at best players. Other teams were asking for way too much, and I am happy Briere did not act out of desperatation and do something foolish; the best trades sometimes are the trades you don't make.

You say Luchenko was a reach, but the fact is most draft gurus, like McKenzie and Button had Luchenko going in the top 20. The Flyers picked him at 13; hardly a reach. What you are not taking into is you and I are not hockey scouts. We are not watching 100s of games, performing player interviews or at the combine. Briere states Luchenko was a player they coveted and I believe them. The fact that a good player like Buium was there and the Flyers still draft Luchenko only proves that Luchenko was the player the Flyers wanted. Sure they hoped they could get him with their 2nd first round pick, but Luchenko's stock had risen so much, that was not possible. So Briere made a choice, do I play it safe and pick the projected top 10 player that fell into my lap, or do I trust my scouts and go with the player that they believe will have the greater upside. Briere chose the latter, we'll see in a couple of seasons whether he chose wisely or not. Honestly, if the draft board fell the way it was projected to fall in mock drafts, no one would be complaining about the Luchenko pick.

The bottom line is the Flyers have 6 picks in the first two rounds of the 2025 draft, and could add to that this off season, or more likely at the trade deadline next season. That is exactly what rebuilding teams do.

You keep at this narrative but I just don't believe its fair or accurate. In this draft Briere did try to aggressively trade into the top 10 to get a potential elite talent, which is what rebuilding teams do. Unfortunately other teams were not biting. It takes two teams to make a trade. Its easy for you and I to say, just trade up, or hey Pinto is supposedly available, just get him in a trade. But the reality is 99% of the trade rumors out there are fantasy, just made up for click bait. The fact is its very hard to make a hockey trade, especially when you are Briere and you are dealing from a position of weakness, in that teams know the Flyers ar tight on cap space and are rebuilding, but worse Briere is trying to sell mediocre at best players. Other teams were asking for way too much, and I am happy Briere did not act out of desperatation and do something foolish; the best trades sometimes are the trades you don't make.

You say Luchenko was a reach, but the fact is most draft gurus, like McKenzie and Button had Luchenko going in the top 20. The Flyers picked him at 13; hardly a reach. What you are not taking into is you and I are not hockey scouts. We are not watching 100s of games, performing player interviews or at the combine. Briere states Luchenko was a player they coveted and I believe them. The fact that a good player like Buium was there and the Flyers still draft Luchenko only proves that Luchenko was the player the Flyers wanted. Sure they hoped they could get him with their 2nd first round pick, but Luchenko's stock had risen so much, that was not possible. So Briere made a choice, do I play it safe and pick the projected top 10 player that fell into my lap, or do I trust my scouts and go with the player that they believe will have the greater upside. Briere chose the latter, we'll see in a couple of seasons whether he chose wisely or not. Honestly, if the draft board fell the way it was projected to fall in mock drafts, no one would be complaining about the Luchenko pick.

The bottom line is the Flyers have 6 picks in the first two rounds of the 2025 draft, and could add to that this off season, or more likely at the trade deadline next season. That is exactly what rebuilding teams do.
- jd250

Sometimes I think you live in fantasy land. Button is a moron and Mackenzie is pretty much retired. Lachenko is a very good prospect, but pretty much the entire scouting community had this kid in the 20-25 range…sure you can find some outliers, but it was a reach….a reach is something so called rebuilding teams don’t or shouldn’t do. The Flyers have now been an irrelevant team for the better part of the last decade. The downfall can be traced to management. Briere to this point has traded away guys Torts didn’t like. Briere has traded guys that didn’t want to be here. He has acquired some assets but been forced to take on horrid contracts and bad $ to do it. Briere has f’d up on our 2nd best prospect and lost him in the process. How do you know Briere was aggressively trying to trade into the top 10? Because he told ya?

What do I see? A team that has had an extremely quiet summer when they are supposed to be in a rebuild. Is this supposed to rebuild it self?

The NHL has been super busy while some teams that need a new direction have been super busy restructuring their teams. The Flyers have not been…great you are happy with a participation ribbon but it appears he just wants to roll this thing back. He’s accomplished nothing since the end of the season.

So what’s that get us? Another mid round pick in the 1rst next year…a couple of late ones (unless he trades them as well). After watching them stumble through this draft I’m glad you trust him and the scouts, although I’m not sure why? Most of these guys are responsible for drafting the current group…..a 20-25th place roster.

It’s RESULTS based business and so far Briere hasn’t delivered poop.

Sometimes I think you live in fantasy land. Button is a moron and Mackenzie is pretty much retired. Lachenko is a very good prospect, but pretty much the entire scouting community had this kid in the 20-25 range…sure you can find some outliers, but it was a reach….a reach is something so called rebuilding teams don’t or shouldn’t do. The Flyers have now been an irrelevant team for the better part of the last decade. The downfall can be traced to management. Briere to this point has traded away guys Torts didn’t like. Briere has traded guys that didn’t want to be here. He has acquired some assets but been forced to take on horrid contracts and bad $ to do it. Briere has f’d up on our 2nd best prospect and lost him in the process. How do you know Briere was aggressively trying to trade into the top 10? Because he told ya?

What do I see? A team that has had an extremely quiet summer when they are supposed to be in a rebuild. Is this supposed to rebuild it self?

The NHL has been super busy while some teams that need a new direction have been super busy restructuring their teams. The Flyers have not been…great you are happy with a participation ribbon but it appears he just wants to roll this thing back. He’s accomplished nothing since the end of the season.

So what’s that get us? Another mid round pick in the 1rst next year…a couple of late ones (unless he trades them as well). After watching them stumble through this draft I’m glad you trust him and the scouts, although I’m not sure why? Most of these guys are responsible for drafting the current group…..a 20-25th place roster.

It’s a RESULTS based business…so far Briere hasn’t delivered poop.


- landros 2

The Michkov arrival is something to look forward to for sure. Drafts are not won or lost necessarily this early but I don’t think this is one that will viewed as a great job by the Flyers. Most so called “rebuilding” teams don’t reach for players in the first round or trade 1rst round picks, for future years….What do they do? They actively trade productive vets and ADD 1rst round picks. Lachenko might be a good one and we all hope he is, but the pick at 12 (13) was a reach.
Yes we’ll hear all the talking heads tell us it’s a rebuild and “look we have 3 1rst round picks in a deep draft next year”…that’s it? That’s your rebuild? After watching you clearly stumble in this years draft, I can’t say I’m confident they will get next years right. This organization continues to look inept. Briere doesn’t look like a GM that can get things done unless he’s willing to take bad $ or a horrid contract to get it done. Colour me unimpressed.
- landros 2

I think you’ve nailed the general thought process of most of us fans.

I’m also thinking, and this is just my own speculation, but with Michkov coming over, part of me thinks the Flyers brass figures “well that will be enough to put butts in the seats and sell jerseys” so they don’t have to commit to any significant movement in their minds.

If it’s a rebuild trade vets and add picks and prospects. If the playoffs are the goal, add players that will take them to the next level and don’t just bring back the same team. Neither is being done. It’s the same 12-16 place finish with no legit hope for the playoffs and no legit evidence of a rebuild. Stuck in neutral with no clear plan. Not to mention we have a number of talented young players that just can’t get the coach to like them but the GM won’t move them.

I think you’ve nailed the general thought process of most of us fans.

I’m also thinking, and this is just my own speculation, but with Michkov coming over, part of me thinks the Flyers brass figures “well that will be enough to put butts in the seats and sell jerseys” so they don’t have to commit to any significant movement in their minds.

If it’s a rebuild trade vets and add picks and prospects. If the playoffs are the goal, add players that will take them to the next level and don’t just bring back the same team. Neither is being done. It’s the same 12-16 place finish with no legit hope for the playoffs and no legit evidence of a rebuild. Stuck in neutral with no clear plan. Not to mention we have a number of talented young players that just can’t get the coach to like them but the GM won’t move them.
- mikeyo27

I am excited for Michkov…at least it’s something, from an organization that has delivered little else. I hate being negative, I’d much rather talk about a team that is somewhat relevant. I’ve listened to what they say, but don’t see the actions to match…it’s just another disappointing off season when they really can’t afford to have one if they ever want to become a relevant team again.

The Michkov arrival is something to look forward to for sure. Drafts are not won or lost necessarily this early but I don’t think this is one that will viewed as a great job by the Flyers. Most so called “rebuilding” teams don’t reach for players in the first round or trade 1rst round picks, for future years….What do they do? They actively trade productive vets and ADD 1rst round picks. Lachenko might be a good one and we all hope he is, but the pick at 12 (13) was a reach.
Yes we’ll hear all the talking heads tell us it’s a rebuild and “look we have 3 1rst round picks in a deep draft next year”…that’s it? That’s your rebuild? After watching you clearly stumble in this years draft, I can’t say I’m confident they will get next years right. This organization continues to look inept. Briere doesn’t look like a GM that can get things done unless he’s willing to take bad $ or a horrid contract to get it done. Colour me unimpressed.
- landros 2

the 2nd rd pick projects as a 4th line center. is that what you shoot for with your 2nd rd picks?

the 2nd rd pick projects as a 4th line center. is that what you shoot for with your 2nd rd picks?
- hello it's me 2050

I was hoping that was only one guys perspective on him…

You keep at this narrative but I just don't believe its fair or accurate. In this draft Briere did try to aggressively trade into the top 10 to get a potential elite talent, which is what rebuilding teams do. Unfortunately other teams were not biting. It takes two teams to make a trade. Its easy for you and I to say, just trade up, or hey Pinto is supposedly available, just get him in a trade. But the reality is 99% of the trade rumors out there are fantasy, just made up for click bait. The fact is its very hard to make a hockey trade, especially when you are Briere and you are dealing from a position of weakness, in that teams know the Flyers ar tight on cap space and are rebuilding, but worse Briere is trying to sell mediocre at best players. Other teams were asking for way too much, and I am happy Briere did not act out of desperatation and do something foolish; the best trades sometimes are the trades you don't make.

You say Luchenko was a reach, but the fact is most draft gurus, like McKenzie and Button had Luchenko going in the top 20. The Flyers picked him at 13; hardly a reach. What you are not taking into is you and I are not hockey scouts. We are not watching 100s of games, performing player interviews or at the combine. Briere states Luchenko was a player they coveted and I believe them. The fact that a good player like Buium was there and the Flyers still draft Luchenko only proves that Luchenko was the player the Flyers wanted. Sure they hoped they could get him with their 2nd first round pick, but Luchenko's stock had risen so much, that was not possible. So Briere made a choice, do I play it safe and pick the projected top 10 player that fell into my lap, or do I trust my scouts and go with the player that they believe will have the greater upside. Briere chose the latter, we'll see in a couple of seasons whether he chose wisely or not. Honestly, if the draft board fell the way it was projected to fall in mock drafts, no one would be complaining about the Luchenko pick.

The bottom line is the Flyers have 6 picks in the first two rounds of the 2025 draft, and could add to that this off season, or more likely at the trade deadline next season. That is exactly what rebuilding teams do.
- jd250

- had he been truly rebuilding they would have had a top 8 pick instead of landing where they did; then trying to trade more assets to move up. why dont you ever account or bring that up? also based on history those picks are rarely moved. so it was somewhat foolish to thin you could move up.

- those 6 picks next year will arrive in philly when? 2028 if all goes well?

- they have the same fn lineup that ended the season with 1 addition in MM. How the phuck is that rebuilding? they have no real plan.

- buy out cam then waste a million in EJ.

- no need in any way to extend GH for 2 years.

- had he been truly rebuilding they would have had a top 8 pick instead of landing where they did; then trying to trade more assets to move up. why dont you ever account or bring that up? also based on history those picks are rarely moved. so it was somewhat foolish to thin you could move up.

- those 6 picks next year will arrive in philly when? 2028 if all goes well?

- they have the same fn lineup that ended the season with 1 addition in MM. How the phuck is that rebuilding? they have no real plan.

- buy out cam then waste a million in EJ.

- no need in any way to extend GH for 2 years.
- hello it's me 2050

Sadly, when we compare ourselves to the the general rank and file Flyers fans, we are in a distinct minority here in Hockeybuzz land.

Most of the fans are eating it up. They have them eating out of their hands with Torts and the "culture" Pablum. They scarf it down and ask for more.

You keep at this narrative but I just don't believe its fair or accurate. In this draft Briere did try to aggressively trade into the top 10 to get a potential elite talent, which is what rebuilding teams do. Unfortunately other teams were not biting. It takes two teams to make a trade. Its easy for you and I to say, just trade up, or hey Pinto is supposedly available, just get him in a trade. But the reality is 99% of the trade rumors out there are fantasy, just made up for click bait. The fact is its very hard to make a hockey trade, especially when you are Briere and you are dealing from a position of weakness, in that teams know the Flyers ar tight on cap space and are rebuilding, but worse Briere is trying to sell mediocre at best players. Other teams were asking for way too much, and I am happy Briere did not act out of desperatation and do something foolish; the best trades sometimes are the trades you don't make.


- jd250

Speaking of narratives. This is the NHL. There are no participation trophies for trying. GM's who try and fail, get fired. Now I'm not suggesting that Briere is at fault for not being able to trade up. The trade has to make sense. The cost has to be worth it and the other team has to be willing. Here you are though, praising him for trying. Briere has quality players to trade. You're wrong on both counts.

You say Luchenko was a reach, but the fact is most draft gurus, like McKenzie and Button had Luchenko going in the top 20. The Flyers picked him at 13; hardly a reach. What you are not taking into is you and I are not hockey scouts. We are not watching 100s of games, performing player interviews or at the combine. Briere states Luchenko was a player they coveted and I believe them. The fact that a good player like Buium was there and the Flyers still draft Luchenko only proves that Luchenko was the player the Flyers wanted. Sure they hoped they could get him with their 2nd first round pick, but Luchenko's stock had risen so much, that was not possible. So Briere made a choice, do I play it safe and pick the projected top 10 player that fell into my lap, or do I trust my scouts and go with the player that they believe will have the greater upside. Briere chose the latter, we'll see in a couple of seasons whether he chose wisely or not. Honestly, if the draft board fell the way it was projected to fall in mock drafts, no one would be complaining about the Luchenko pick.


- jd250

It was a reach. It's just a question of how big of a reach. There was a higher rated player there and a bigger need available. He passed and took the lesser rated player. Briere didn't say that they took the player with the greater upside. They said they didn't want to draft a smaller defenseman with already having Drysdale, York and Andrae. Emil Andrae? Who isn't an established NHL player. Just ridiculous and absurd reasoning. Here you again ending with fantasy. The draft fell the way it felled and any hypothetical is irrelevant.

The bottom line is the Flyers have 6 picks in the first two rounds of the 2025 draft, and could add to that this off season, or more likely at the trade deadline next season. That is exactly what rebuilding teams do.
- jd250

You keep praising them for incompletes. If you half ass a rebuild, which the Flyers are doing. It's not a rebuild. It's a retool. Half rebuilding, half not. That is not exactly what rebuilding teams do.

The bottom line is that you're completely out of touch with reality.

- had he been truly rebuilding they would have had a top 8 pick instead of landing where they did; then trying to trade more assets to move up. why dont you ever account or bring that up? also based on history those picks are rarely moved. so it was somewhat foolish to thin you could move up.

- those 6 picks next year will arrive in philly when? 2028 if all goes well?

- they have the same fn lineup that ended the season with 1 addition in MM. How the phuck is that rebuilding? they have no real plan.

- buy out cam then waste a million in EJ.

- no need in any way to extend GH for 2 years.
- hello it's me 2050

No top 10 pick trades in the NHL in the last 2 years. If rumors are to be believed, 3 1st round picks (one of which was the Flyers 12th, wasn't even close to being enough to trade into the top 4 on their own and we are supposed to believe that next year someone is going to give the Flyers a discount to draft a franchise player?

If you want that pick you'd better get there on your own and the Flyers are unwilling to do that. The Flyers have sacrificed quality for quantity. Teams like CHI and SJ decided not to limit themselves and to pursue both paths, drafting quality and quantity.

Jett better be great or Buium a bust because some of his traits have been compared to Hughes and Makar with the accolades to prove it. As someone said before, the Flyers received a gift with Buium falling and returned the gift.

Edit: For Briere to see any of his draft picks play in 2028 will mean he is the longest tenured GM not named Holmgren or Clarke in the last 40 years

And an assistant coaches job on retirement.

Everything I've read about Scott Laughton points to a principled stand up guy and good teammate but why is he still on this team? Same thing with Travis Konecny.

No top 10 pick trades in the NHL in the last 2 years. If rumors are to be believed, 3 1st round picks (one of which was the Flyers 12th, wasn't even close to being enough to trade into the top 4 on their own and we are supposed to believe that next year someone is going to give the Flyers a discount to draft a franchise player?

If you want that pick you'd better get there on your own and the Flyers are unwilling to do that. The Flyers have sacrificed quality for quantity. Teams like CHI and SJ decided not to limit themselves and to pursue both paths, drafting quality and quantity.

Jett better be great or Buium a bust because some of his traits have been compared to Hughes and Makar with the accolades to prove it. As someone said before, the Flyers received a gift with Buium falling and returned the gift.

Edit: For Briere to see any of his draft picks play in 2028 will mean he is the longest tenured GM not named Holmgren or Clarke in the last 40 years
- Flyers_01

Blunt….but true.

No top 10 pick trades in the NHL in the last 2 years. If rumors are to be believed, 3 1st round picks (one of which was the Flyers 12th, wasn't even close to being enough to trade into the top 4 on their own and we are supposed to believe that next year someone is going to give the Flyers a discount to draft a franchise player?

If you want that pick you'd better get there on your own and the Flyers are unwilling to do that. The Flyers have sacrificed quality for quantity. Teams like CHI and SJ decided not to limit themselves and to pursue both paths, drafting quality and quantity.

Jett better be great or Buium a bust because some of his traits have been compared to Hughes and Makar with the accolades to prove it. As someone said before, the Flyers received a gift with Buium falling and returned the gift.

Edit: For Briere to see any of his draft picks play in 2028 will mean he is the longest tenured GM not named Holmgren or Clarke in the last 40 years
- Flyers_01

Some don't seem to understand. It is elite player or bust for this team. Same as it is for every team. You look at the teams that win. You need at a minimum a 1C and a 1D. You really need about 4 elite level players. How do you get that. Yea, low percentage chance that Drysdale turns into a 1C but I doubt it. Luchanko may wind up being a 1C but odds are against that. Flyers could get lucky with a lower pick and that player could wind up elite. That's happened once in the last 20 years or so with Giroux. The Flyers have shown they can draft plenty of good players. They have good players now. They're not a good team because they don't have elite level players. Compare them to other teams that are rebuilding and they have more arrows in their quiver compared to the Flyers. We have Michkov and that's it. The Flyers getting high draft picks has not happened due to planning and execution. It's happened due to incompetence.
We're supposed to believe that the triumvirate's beautiful collaboration and Tortorella the savior is going to get them there. That building culture and playing the right way is going to get them there. Sadly, the overwhelming majority of the gullible fan base thinks they are and that the team actually accomplished something last season simply by being harder to play against and improving to 21st in the league.

Hayes and Deangelo weren't the only ones. Provy. Allison. Frost and Farabee are now a female genitalia hair away from the same fate.

Go back and look at how the Rangers and Jackets lineups shifted over time from the beginning of Tort's tenure to the end. The teams just get grindier and grindier and grindier and a bunch of skilled players either get flushed out or can't escape fast enough.
- Tomahawk

For the sake of accuracy, Torts didn’t jettison Provy - Provy wanted out and requested a trade. I forgot about Allison, however Farabee and Frost are still on the team

Everything I've read about Scott Laughton points to a principled stand up guy and good teammate but why is he still on this team? Same thing with Travis Konecny.
- Uncle Vanya

Glue guys …all about the culture….if Torts wants to impress me? Build a culture without Laughton…without Konecny…without Sanheim… no one guy should be that intricate to a team culture…

For the sake of accuracy, Torts didn’t jettison Provy - Provy wanted out and requested a trade. I forgot about Allison, however Farabee and Frost are still on the team
- anti-lame

Why did Provy want out and ask for a trade?

Why did Provy want out and ask for a trade?
- MBFlyerfan

I think it was frustration from the team not winning and his own level of play. I think he felt he needed a change of scenery in order to feel good about himself and for a chance to be successful and to rebuild himself as a player. He simply wasn't happy with the Flyers. I don't think Tortorella had a ton to do with that. It was happening before Tortorella got there. He was mishandled as a player from the time he was drafted.

Everything I've read about Scott Laughton points to a principled stand up guy and good teammate but why is he still on this team? Same thing with Travis Konecny.
- Uncle Vanya

Well, Laughton is a fine player to have on your back 6 if you’re a winning team, and likely nobody is willing to part with what the Flyers want. He's not that expensive, so I guess they’re comfortable with him as a locker room guys and dependable cheap option until the right deal comes along. If. If it comes along.

TK has more value, but I’m not sure if even the Flyers have decided what to do with him. My guess is he becomes a trade deadline guy, but who knows? I mentioned ages ago Zegras would be an interesting swap with him because of how deep the Ducks are with center but nothing else. Well, they’ve been attending to their wing needs since then. Savoie was another guy I was thinking of in a package deal, but as of today he’s off to Edmonton. Bring a jacket, kid.

That’s the thing with me. I don’t think they exactly know what to do with what they’ve got. They’re undecided instead of following a path.